The Message Forum is an ongoing dialogue among classmates. The goal is to encourage friendly interaction, including interaction among classmates who really didn't know each other. Experience on the site has revealed that certain topics tend to cause friction and hard feelings, especially politics and religion. 

Although politics and religion are not completely off-limits, classmates are asked to be positive in their posts and not to be too repetitive or allow a dialog to degenerate into an argument. 

Forums work when people participate - so don't be bashful! Click the "Post Response" button to add your entry to the forum.

Bob Davidson

David and Lowell,

When you question whether LBJ was a liberal -- the answer is that he was an oportunist who thought that it didn't really count if he was corrupt if he managed to get the government to do good things for the people -- like the various Civil Rights Acts. (Of course, to me and many other libertarian conservatives, "amoral opportunist" is synonymous with "liberal politician," but I am certainly very aware of the mindset that equates seemingly noble political opinions with virtue -- hence virtue signaling and socialism.)

Robert Caro wrote an exhaustive four very long volumes biography of LBJ.  Caro was an Eastern liberal who hated Johnson with a seething passion but dug, dug, dug into every unpleasant detail of Johnson's life, accurately, but with incredible animosity.  He portrayed Johnson as a sort of bigger than life genius evil monster.

In the Master of the Senate volume he described how LBJ manipulated both the Richard Russell old school racist Dems who had the seniority to control the committees by convincing them that he agreed with them, but couldn't really be one of them publicly because he was from Texas which wasn't really part of the Deep South, and the Hubert Humphrey World War II veteran liberals by convincing them that he agreed with them, but had to keep all those Southern racists in Texas happy so he couldn't show it publically.  Russell and Humphrey both considered LBJ to be a close personal friend.  He also convinced both groups that he was able to keep the crazy liberal commies or crazy reactionary racists from doing real harm if they didn't block the legislation he supported.*  What worked with the senators with whom he had a personal relationship made their idiologically fanatic followers despise LBJ, like Bobby Kennedy. Humphrey and Russell were the leaders of the two factions of the Democratic Party in the 1950s.

These books are absolutely fascinating.  Hillary Clinton obviously read them because she pulled a number of his tricks during her sad little Senate career, ultimately unsuccessfully since she brazenly shared his utter lack of normal morality, but lacked his skills.  (The story of her pitiful life.)

* Barely exaggerated:  "Richard, if you fellows block me on this, Hubert and those other Yankees will get together with Dirksen and his boys to impose manditory miscegination your daughters."  "Hubert, if you don't support me on this, Stennis and the other unreconstructed Confederates are going to try to impose Jim Crow on the whole damn country." 

Ron Knight

Charlie Kirk, 31 and well known conservative activist was assasinated on the campus of Utah Valley University this afternoon. He was shot in the neck and rushed to a nearby hospital in critical condition. President Trump just announced his death. The shooter is still at large.

RIP Charlie. 

I am too angry with MSNBC and CNN for some of their comments of Charlie's shooting to post them here. DISGUSTING!

Jim Bedwell

Bob D, David, et al,

Yes, LBJ was a creep. He cheated on his wife to a considerable degree. He called his male organ "Jumbo"; how obscenely prideful and disgusting was he in that.

And he helped derail the civil rights legislation in the late 50's in his leadership role in the Senate. At least he did sign the Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act when he was President in 1964 and 1965, in my opinion, only blowing with the prevailing wind of the time at that later time.

Jim Bedwell

Ron,

Yes, the left loves to virtue signal by talking about, among many other falsities, the violence of their political opposition. But the overwhelming majority of the violence found in America's political arena emanates from them. Nobody tried to kill Biden, but how about the attempts to kill Trump? The shooting of Steve Scalise at the Congressional ball game a few years ago? The guy who traveled across the country to try to kill Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh at his house? Plus their ongoing verbiage is often to talk about taking people on the right OUT. Charlie Kirk, 31 years old, RIP..............

David Cordell

The killing of Charlie Kirk is making me sick to my stomach. What a very bright and articulate young man. What a waste.

Jim Bedwell

Here's the 1820-pound winner for pumpkins at the Alaska State Fair this year.

David Cordell

What are young people learning and doing?

• Assassination attempt on Trump.
• Assassination of United Health Care president.
• Assassination of Charlie Kirk.

Janalu Jeanes (Parchman)

Charlie Kirk was the kind of super nice, clean-cut, very intelligent young man that most parents would be thrilled to have walk up to the front door, entering the house, as a date for their daughter.  He also had a strong Christian faith, which was a point of contention for some of his detractors, particularly the LGBTQ crowd and the far-left Progressive/Marxists.

I saw him debate often on televised events, where he was angrily attacked in discussions, by some of those people who couldn't stand to hear his excellent answers about his beliefs or his conservativism.  He could carry on controlled and measured repertoire with them, until they usually just turned away, frustrated that his answers were backed up with hard facts they didn't want to accept.  I never saw him raise his voice in a heated way, toward any of those folks.

The sadness of his loss is overwhelming.

It is also sad that there are evil ones among us who do not want "free speech" to reign in our country, since the speech, which may be conservative, is not what those demented people want to hear at all, when it is averse to their own thoughts.

Jan Alexander

I had heard of Charlie Kirk and he was also admired by many liberals. It is another loss added to the list of citizens that cared deeply for our country. Ron, I read your post and then turned on CNN to see what you were talking about and all I saw was some very heart felt respect for Mr. Kirk and sadness for his loss and the discussion of the increase of disgusting political violence..

Vigilante activity has become an all too common form of political violence. Gov. (Dem)Josh Shapiro’s home was set on fire, Musk’s Tesla’s destroyed, Trumps 2 assassination attempts, N. Mexico’s Rep. Head quarters torched, the Democratic National committee office in Arizona was shot up, Nancy Pelosi’s husband was attacked, the Dem. Candidate for Louisville major was a target of a shooting attempt, there was a plot to kidnap Dem. Gov. Whitmer, the shooting at a Republican baseball practice, the gun man who entered 2 Dem. Minnesota lawmaker home's and killed 2 and wounded the other 2 and Gabby Gifford’s attempt. I am sure I am leaving something out. ....and just plain ole political violence like Jan. 6th. 

It all has got to stop… How did we loose the place of mutual respect for each other where opposite sides don’t consider each other evil or mortal enemies and the only answer is to kill each other. For starters ,we need leaders that strive to unite all of us , for we are a mixed society .  Could get in to guns.. but not now.

Free speech goes for all ..  like Janalu says and which also pertains to the Hank's ordeal. 

Edited : God, another shooting at the Evergreen Co. high school .  Too much..........

  where it all began... and to no end.

Ron Knight

Jan

You need to check out the comments before his death was confirmed. One comment was the shooter could have been a supporter of Charlie's just shooting his gun in excitement over his comments, one said after the DC shooting Trump brought in the National Guard that was Trump's excuse for his action. The reporter just wondered what Trump will do after this shooting. NO comments about Charlie's well being at all. ALMOST a smug attitude that he deserved it from another reporter from his comments that Charlie promotes hateful rhetoric and should know that he should have been aware this could happen.

NEVER has Charlie promoted hate. He ONLY invites open dialogue with no yelling or raising voices. He was a great debater and never belittled anyone. He would always thank them for sharing their views, although he disagreed with them.

I'll reserve my comments further until we get the suspect in custody and find out the motive. I doubt the shooter was a supporter of Charlie, however.

What's lost is that Charlie was a young man with a wife and two small children. The smallest just turned 1 this past May. Prayers for his wife Erika and those children who lost their father today. 

Marty Fulton

Well said, Ron.  I must have watched 15 or 20 of Charlie Kirk's videos on youtube over the past 10 days.  No one can fill his shoes, I feel an emptyness already, having a voice of TRUTH removed forever.  I even learned several facts amidst his responses to, well, largely pinheads who attend our nations' colleges. 

How come no liberals are being targeted?  As far as Paul Pelosi's attack in Oct 2022 is concerned, there is a lot of 'suspicion' associated with the 'alleged attack'.  The broken glass door was initiated from the inside of the house.  And when the police showed up, the alleged attacker was in the foyer with Pelosi behaving in a non-threatening manner.  The Vaseline jar was never found....

Should the UTAH POLICE/FBI catch the shooter, I would pay good money to flip the switch that ends his pitiful life....

Damn right I'm mad!!!!

David Cordell

This post from Charlie Kirk was re-posted by one of our classmates.

Janalu Jeanes (Parchman)

David,

Those words of Charlie Kirk, in the above post, ring so very true.

Have we not heard some of the venom spewed from some of our own classmates here, on this forum?

The venom..."Of the left being whipped into a violent frenzy....."

May our better angels temper us to be calmer; more civil and rational.  

Sorry to sound like an old, hard-nosed school marm or mommie........a recurring habit I need to temper..........

On another note:

I just read online from the Wall Street Journal:  A rifle was found in the woods just beyond the Utah site of the assassination of C. Kirk.  Investigators say there were anti-fascist words scratched on the surfaces of the ammunition, as well as transgender references too.   Unbelievable discovery.......

Wayne Gary

On a nice note.

Yesterday I went to the Carter Museum in Ft Worth and saw 2 art exhits. The first was 80 20th century masters from the collection of Butts of HEB Stores. First time he has had a showing. In the next gallery was a Asian American  artists from the 20th century.  Some of the arrt was by people in the WW ll internment camps,  Very good. Both are free.  If you go take University East  from I30 to left  on Camp Bowie then  left across construction into parking lot.

Bob Wainner

David;

I agree with you about the "assassination of Charlie Kirk".....I was really holding back the tears when I learned he had actually passed away. What a GREAT guy, Husband, Father, Christian & Conservative activist.  I know he was only 31 years old (but he seemed far beyond his years)...I think he would have made an outstanding "President of The United States" after age 36.....had he not been murdered.  A terrible loss for his Family & America!

It appears that the FBI is getting close to catching the young guy who shot Charlie Kirk....lots of evidence - even a couple of pretty clear photos of him. The FBI is offering $100,000.00 for information to the capture of this murderer. I think it was great about all of the college venues Charlie Kirk was holding...but I sure wish he had considered adding more "security". Like having people check building roof tops...maybe having a couple of drones in the air. He had been getting a lot of threats & you'd think after what happened with President Trump in Butler, PA...Charlie would have been a bit more cautious and add more "security" at those outdoor events.  WHEY didn't someone suggest he ADD "good security measures"???

I'm thinking...in 2028, the GOP may have J.D. Vance run for President...with a couple of different choices for the VP (Ron Desantis or maybe Kristi Noem). I really like Marco Rubio (though, he's a bit on the short side...he's still very good at what he's doing...and could remain in that position). 

This "Left Wing" radical hatred, protesting & killing HAS to stop.  I remember the years growing up...America seemed like a pretty SAFE place to be. NOT any longer.  Single women need to be especially careful...and not go places alone. I long for the days when "America" felt like a safe & great Nation to live in.

Bob

Janalu Jeanes (Parchman)

It seems to me we may have reached a point where the outdoor venues with large, gathering crowds, may have to seriously consider using bulletproof, transparent material around the speaker, since we have a trigger-happy, kneejerk bunch of citizens, quick to react with violence to express their differing opinions or ideologies.

It's an unfortunate turn we see developing more and more, as the days go on.

I was just reading online about a high school Social Studies, male teacher, who was relieved of his duties yesterday.  In referring to Charlie Kirk's murder, he told his students, "Thoughts and prayers to his children, but IMHO America became greater today.  There, I said it!"   (He was referencing Trump's slogan of "Make America Great Again.")

The guy's name is Wynne Boliek, who lives in Greenville South Carolina.

Maybe you have seen the story, or a story that's similar.  I heard Matthew Dowd was also dismissed as an MSNBC host, yesterday.

Ron Knight

Janalu

Matthew Dowd is a RINO who has not been relative for 20 years, but was MSNBC's token "Republican". It was easy to fire him. There have been multiple firings from the left with disgusting comments over Charlie's death including the Carolina Panthers staffer, an Assistant Dean of students of Middle Tenneesee State University from just my part of the country and on and on. NOT to mention the Tik Tok, Facebook and more deranged posters celebrating his death.

What is MOST disturbing is from a member of Congress, Ilhan Omar (D) Minn. In an article written today by Daily Mail (UK) titled "Squad member Ilhan Omar laughs as she mocks Charlie Kirk in callous rant"

I'll let you read the entire article, but I'll just give you a couple of quotes from this elected official for the Democrats.

"The progressive 'Squad' member laughed during an interview while dismissing tributes to Kirk's legacy, branding his views as fucked up and accusing him of a decade of spreading hate"

"There are a lot of people who are talking about him just wanting to have a civil debate, Omar said with a sneer. These people are full of shit and it's important for us to call them out while we feel anger and sadness."

A real class act for a Congresswoman wouldn't you say????

The Democrats have NEVER needed a "Charlie Kirk" in their rank and file. They have the main stream media as their propoganda machine along with Hollywood, NGO's and for so many years control polictically, especially since Obama. Charlie became a real threat to them as Trump. I think their "Party of Peace" left the building and is MIA. The corruption of this once proud party is getting exposed daily.

I don't like using curse words here, but I left them in Ilhan Omar's quotes for the full effect of her callous rant.

Lowell Tuttle

I miss Conan

David Cordell

So one of the shell casings had an inscription: "Hey, fascist! Catch!"

People who throw around the terms "fascist" and "nazi" should recognize that doing so can have consequences. Who actually qualifies as a fascist or nazi? Just stop it!

David Cordell

Sandra and Jan,

Since you haven't accepted my wager, I am going to alter it.  Still my $1,000 against your $100, but the conditions are as follows:

1) There will be a presidential election in 2028.

2) Trump will not be the Republican nominee.

I changed the second one because it occurred to me that some nefarious/Democrat groups may want to put Trump on a ballot as an independent just to draw votes away from the Republican nominee. I am not sure if one can put someone on a ballot without that person's permission, but just in case ...Oh, and my caveat still applies:

If the democratic socialists/communists take over such that there is no election, that wouldn't be Dictator Trump's fault. You still have to pay up.

Wayne Gary

David,

There is a classmate of ours that treows around those terms an has called those of us he considers consertive to be one or all of the terms. 

Jan Alexander

David, 

 I liked what Gov. Cox of Utah had to say this morning . He has been very sincere and unifying during this time of mourning and I think he is right , this is a "watershed moment"; hopefully towards a more respectful future and not into a more violent one.    

Janalu Jeanes (Parchman)

I just saw on TV the face of the young guy who is supposedly the killer of Charlie Kirk.

It is astounding to me that a guy who looks like him, just an ordinary middle-class college-aged young man, could be SO radicalized to go out and MURDER a young speaker on a stage, just for some notion that the speaker was evil and was saying WORDS that his 22 year old brain didn't like.

I grew up knowing that is was NEVER, repeat NEVER okay to KILL anyone!  IT was NEVER okay to take away someone's life!

How could a young college student EVER get it in his head to take away another man's life on a whim or a notion?

It's just a concept I can't grasp in any way.

The 10 commandments, I still say, would do a worthy service, hanging on a wall in a school.  If there are those who would prefer to have the commandments that mention G-O-D  NOT be on the plaque, then leave those commandments off, but have the commandments about killing, stealing, lying, properly ignoring a neighbor's stuff, and honoring one's parents on the plaque.  Those 'rules' were given to mankind for a darn good reason, the reason being THEY WORK and THEY HELP a person's life go along properly.

A public school may be the only time a student gets to know and think about those concepts, since many parents today don't have a religion they practice.

Scouting also, in my opinion, helps youngsters get in the habit of living within the honorable 'rules' too, as well as help kids learn about getting along with each other and with members in Scouts who come from various backgrounds.

David Cordell

Some on the left have made disgusting comments about Charlie Kirk's assassination, but not these fellows, quoted on a website.

Bill Clinton

The 42nd president of the United States said that he was "saddened and angered" by Charlie's murder. 

"I hope we all go through some serious introspection and redouble our efforts to engage in debate passionately, yet peacefully," Clinton wrote on X. "Hillary and I are keeping Erika, their two young children, and their family in our prayers."

Joe Biden 

Echoing his fellow leaders' sentiments, the 82-year-old reiterated that there is "no place in our country for this kind of violence."

"It must end now," Biden wrote on X, adding that he and wife Jill Biden are "praying for Charlie Kirk’s family and loved ones."

George W. Bush

After the tragedy, the former POTUS spoke out against the violent attack. 

"It happened on a college campus, where the open exchange of opposing ideas should be sacrosanct," Bush shared in a statement. "Violence and vitriol must be purged from the public square. Members of other political parties are not our enemies; they are our fellow citizens."

He added, "May God bless Charlie Kirk and his family, and may God guide America toward civility."

Jim Bedwell

Wayne,

We all know whom you're talking about when you mention our classmate who calls us on the right, "fascist" or "Nazi" - so ironic that it seems that nobody on the left understands the nature of the historic, real totalitarians who WERE fascists & Nazis, and that this nature is NOT represented in the current-day, so-described objects of the left's hatred. Which reminds me of what journalist Bernie Goldberg, a few weeks ago on O'Reily, said about his fellow Jew, Senator Chuck Schumer - Schumer made 1600 on the SAT, a perfect score and better than anybody from our graduating class. Bernie said "It just goes to show that a superior mind is a terrible thing to waste to become a political hack". YEE HAW!

I hadn't really known all that much about Charlie Kirk. I hadn't known he had skipped college or that he was born again or that his main activity was reaching out with the truth, both secular and spiritual, to young people. I do know that he's currently with our Lord Jesus, Who is TREMENDOUSLY pleased with the late Charlie.

In conclusion, as Jesus, aka Yeshua Ha Mashiach, said,

"At that time Jesus declared, "I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because You have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this was well-pleasing in Your sight.

All things have been entrusted to Me by My Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him.

Come to Me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.' " (Matthew 11:25-30 Berean Study Bible)